Washington Planning Board
Washington Planning Board
Meeting Minutes
July 5, 2016
0.0 Assembly: 6:00PM
0.1 Members present: Crandall, Kluk, Dulac, Schwartz and Williams
0.2 Alternates present: Terani, Hatch and Russell
0.3 Members and Alternates Absent: None
0.4 Visitors: Stephen Lowe and Mike Leedberg, Peter Mellen, Gwen Gaskell
1.0 Crandall called the Public Hearing to order at 6:00PM.
Hearing for Leedberg/Lowe Annexation:
Crandall explained the intent of the annexation; Mike Leedberg is annexing part of TM 14-363 to TM 14-361, owned by Stephen Lowe, and part of TM 14-363 to TM 14-362, owned by him.
We had looked at the survey map and went through the application checklist at our June meeting and accepted it as complete. Crandall and Kluk looked through the checklist one more time. There were no public comments. Crandall asked Mellen about the mylars and he had one with him and will provide the other one on Thursday. Williams made a motion to close the hearing, Kluk seconded the motion and all voted in favor. Crandall closed the hearing at 6:05PM.
Crandall opened the regular meeting at 6:06PM.
2.0 Minutes: June 20th working meeting, June 28th working meeting
June 20th working meeting, Williams had a few corrections to the minutes to clarify a few statements and Kluk added a few others. Crandall commented that Schwartz takes good minutes and he feels we should fix typos but not the content. Williams feels we need to accurately capture what is said. Dulac thinks so many changes are unusual. Russell commented that keeping the minutes is arduous and he thinks we should be clear on decisions but the narrative is too much. Williams thinks we should start recording our meetings, the message that gets delivered should be accurate. Terani suggested we stop talking over and interrupting each other. Dulac suggested less narrative and narrow the minutes to have more written about the discussion leading up to the vote, leave out the pre-discussion. Crandall likes the minutes because they capture a lot. Schwartz will make the corrections. Dulac motioned to approve the minutes with corrections, Crandall seconded the motion and all voted in favor.
June 28th working meeting, Hatch suggested we change the meeting time to 9AM. Williams had a suggested addition to 2.0, Hatch suggested changing a % to a $, Kluk suggested adding “foundation of” to the discussion about a structural engineer. Schwartz will make the corrections. Kluk motioned to approve the minutes with corrections, Williams seconded the motion and all voted in favor.
3.0 New Business: None
4.0 Old Business:
4.1 Mike Leedberg and Stephen Lowe, annexation:
Crandall asked for a motion, Williams made a motion to approve the annexation, pending the second outstanding mylar from Mellen. Kluk seconded the motion and all voted in favor. Crandall signed and dated the available mylar and Stephen Lowe provided the checks for the hearing and the LCHIP fee. Crandall signed a paper copy for Mellen’s record. Schwartz will bring the mylar to the Registry of Deeds.
4.2 Ryan Curran, Business Permit:
We haven’t yet received any new material from Curran for the Washington General Store business permit. Crandall said that Meridian had suggested removing a bedroom from the house septic system as a work around for the loading problem. We will need a letter from them and will need DES approval before we can accept this as a solution. Williams thinks that we should always check for changes through a site visit before we approve the transfer of a business to new ownership.
4.3 Municipal Buildings Project:
Kluk spoke about meeting with the BoS last Thursday to ask for funds for the architect for the Public Safety Building project. She ended up going alone to see them to ask for $5K to have Kyle Barker work up several plans for us, but they said no. She had sent us all copies of the request letter and a synopsis of what was said at the meeting. She asked us if we had any questions. Dulac said the bottom line is that the BoS said we need to do lots of work but are we supposed to do professional evaluation ourselves? Kluk said Williams is laying out a floor plan, they want us to roll up our sleeves and do that sort of work before we engage an architect. She said relative to the Town Hall we have only had one meeting so far so we haven’t come up with suggestions on that building yet. She said it is a chicken and egg discussion, we can’t know what is needed until a structural engineer looks at it. The BoS wants to bring in a structural engineer on the existing Fire Station; Schwartz said we have a report from a structural engineer on that building already. Kluk said they want us to meet with them and Anthony Costello to have a discussion. Crandall asked Kluk about the level of cooperation from the BoS. Kluk said it was about the same as the last meeting, They feel they want fresh eyes from a new architect and don’t feel it is a good idea to bring the Fire/Rescue people in until we have a plan fleshed out. Terani asked if our letter of request was in the minutes and Williams said it should have been in the correspondence but wasn’t, he will make sure it gets in there. Kluk felt she got close to getting some money but having three scenarios was a sticking point. They felt that tweaking an option shouldn’t cost $1K. Schwartz said she didn’t think that tweaking an option would cost $1K, Barker is reasonable. Kluk wasn’t successful and she did a lot of listening.
Crandall said that an important step is to meet with Fire/Rescue and get some feedback from them and bring them up-to-date. He has set a meeting with them for Thursday, 7/7 at the Center Station at 7PM. He thinks the groups involved need to buy into both projects so we need to start that process. Kluk reminded us we have a meeting next Monday, 7/11, also. Terani said we hoped to get something done for the BBQ, so we need to move on it. Williams said that it was made clear at the BoS meeting that they thought it was premature. Kluk said she was surprised that the BoS wasn’t supportive of this because Williams was supportive at our meeting. Williams said that in his mind we won’t have anything done for the BBQ, they felt it was premature if we weren’t moving forward with something now. Kluk thought they were on the same page with us with the idea of using the existing station and adding a barn. Williams thinks spending $5K now is too early; there are things we can do to flesh out the ideas without working through what we need to come up with. Kluk said she suggested working on just one idea but the BoS shot it down. She thinks it is a bad idea not to go to the Fire/Rescue to talk about Costello’s ideas. Dulac said that none of us are Fire or Rescue or engineers, so we need to reach out to them. He read through the minutes of our meeting several times and noted that Barker said we shouldn’t do something quick, just to save money, that won’t stand the test of time. Dulac wants to know what we will present when we go to see the Fire/Rescue? Crandall envisions that we will take Costello’s plans and show them and get some feedback. Kluk wants to relay the good options and let them know what Barker said. She thinks we are on the same page as the BoS about trying to use the existing station and add a new barn. Dulac thinks we are on different timelines and aren’t together with the BoS on that. Williams said that the BoS believes that a realistic option for 2017 isn’t possible but some unforeseen thing might happen, but that we should shoot for 2018. Crandall said we are running up against a hard deadline. Dulac doesn’t feel we can be confident enough to do what is needed, we don’t have the expertise, are we going to save any money? Terani said if we don’t have the tools we need to make some decisions the details will kill us, we are asking for some tools but keep getting turned down. Hatch feels the BoS doesn’t want to shoot for a real solution, this is passive/aggressive behavior. He felt at our meeting there was a good sense of progress; we were furnished with Costello’s plans after the fact, the last two plans were the result of their working with Costello. He thinks a respectful conversation with Fire/Rescue is appropriate and he is disappointed by the attitude of the BoS. Schwartz asked if Williams had spoken to Barker about the BoS decision, he hadn’t yet but would after tonight. Dulac said that the BoS have stated that we are not ready, but what can we do to get to the that point where we are ready to get some money to move forward and have some pros come in. Williams said it was touched on, they think we are still in the early stage on both projects. The message was that there are people in town who can draw some plans, come up with some ideas, they would all later hinge on facts from an engineering study (i.e. do the minimum required on the TH foundation, for an example), come up with 3 scenarios on each building project. Kluk said that the BoS specifically need to layout their vision beyond what Williams brings to the table, is it to meet the needs at the lowest possible price point? Dulac asked what if we met in a work session and laid out what we think needs to be done and bring it to the BoS? Kluk said we just had our first meeting on the Town Hall; we need to work up a low, medium and high plan for the building and bring it to the BoS. Crandall said we have a different approach than the BoS, they think a top down approach is best, where they decide and we feel a bottom up approach is better and a discussion with Fire/Rescue is important.
Terani said we are missing something here, we should meet with Costello and do layouts, and we don’t need to go to an architect. Crandall said that Barker pointed out some problems with Costello’s plans. Kluk said the BoS thinks we can do this ourselves but she is worried about HVAC, electrical, plumbing, can we do bid ready plans ourselves, she thinks they need to be stamped plans to move forward. Williams said there is $50K-$75K in the soft cost budget for this, he feels we shouldn’t spend half of the planning money we have so early in the process. He feels Kathy Atkins is a capable person. Terani said she is working with Costello and is capable. Williams said the BoS wouldn’t pay for anything at this point. Crandall tried to end the discussion here. Russell wanted to try to articulate for the BoS what they want for Fire/Rescue; they want a firehouse that is modern and appropriate for a town our size, he feels we should discuss that with them. Crandall doesn’t think the BoS has come to a final decision yet. Terani said you start a project with stated goals and work toward them. Kluk said we will meet with the Fire/Rescue Thursday night and bring Costello’s plans. Williams said this may backfire, you need to have a clear message of salvaging the existing building and adding a barn. Crandall doesn’t think it could backfire. Dulac said depending on how the meeting goes, they may be entrenched, we can explain we are in the middle and ask them to help us make it work. Schwartz doesn’t think they are entrenched. Crandall said we should make it clear we don’t have a plan yet and show the plans the BoS got from Costello and get some ideas from them. Terani asked if we know what the Fire/Rescue objected to with last year’s plan. Schwartz is confident that we do know their objections. Crandall wants to ask if 10 feet away is a problem, he doesn’t want to shove anything down their throats, the reuse of the existing station is important. Kluk wants to ask F/R what they think the town will vote for; she would like to listen and find out how we can work toward something that will pass.
4.4 Accessory Dwelling Units:
Kluk said that Schwartz sent everyone a copy of the draft ADU ordinance. She gave everyone a little background saying that the state passed SB 146 allowing attached ADU’s in all municipalities wherever there is a residential/one family zone. She said that we have options we can add or if we do nothing the state’s version says what can be done. She said we have flexibility in parking regulations, owner occupancy, whether it is the owner’s primary dwelling, architectural appearance, we can limit the number of ADUs allowed per property and we can limit the number of unrelated people occupying a unit. There are also things we cannot change. She said that detached units are not mandatory but are an option that could require a larger lot size. She said the state law is effective June 2017. Hatch asked if the draft ordinance is based on Londonderry’s and she said yes. Dulac asked if we are looking for approval tonight and Crandall said we are just working on it.
We went over the draft section by section. She added the ADU to the “One Dwelling-One Lot Rule”. Williams asked if the dwelling unit is an attached unit and she said that #5 covers that but we have the option of allowing detached where a lot is large enough to accommodate one. Williams asked whether this is a rental unit and would the ADUs make guest cottages obsolete? Dulac feels the “no kitchen” rule is a joke because people set up kitchens anyway; he is concerned about septic also. Williams feels the discussion is whether we take out the guest cottage part and let the ADU language cover it. Kluk said state law doesn’t allow detached but we can. Williams made a motion to allow all three, Crandall prefers not allowing detached. Schwartz seconded the motion so we could have a discussion. Kluk said we have a lot of small lots in town and lot coverage and setbacks would have to be enforced. Schwartz suggested we start slowly and just allow attached. Williams thinks enforcement and the variance process could be a problem. Crandall asked if we could just limit them to the primary building. Kluk said you could keep the look of a single-family home. Williams thinks we shouldn’t be too restrictive. Hatch thinks you can’t tell people what to build. Crandall called for a vote on the motion to allow all three, but it didn’t pass. Williams asked for a list of what we need to make decisions on. We decided to go through the ordinance by section. Hatch asked why 301.1.3 was highlighted. Kluk explained that we have cluster housing in the LUO and we need to look at how this affects that section. Schwartz said that the smaller lots allowed with cluster are more of a problem with detached ADUs. Kluk asked if we want to allow more than one ADU, we decided to limit it to one. Crandall suggested we have them attached to the principle structure only and there was no second. Dulac made a motion to limit it to one ADU attached to an existing building on the property, Kluk seconded that motion and all voted in favor. Kluk asked about 301.1.6 and the option to require the owner to reside in the structure as their primary residence. Williams asked if we have a reason to do that, could we just say that the owner utilizes the unit. Hatch added that the owner occupies the unit. Kluk said can eliminate that and cover it in 301.1. We eliminated the appearance part and decided not to restrict size but hold the ADU to two bedrooms. We added the word “sanitation” to 301.1.9 and took out “adequate”. Williams wanted to eliminate 301.1.10, which talks about septic systems needing to be certified in accordance with RSA 485-A:38, he thinks it is covered by the building permit. Schwartz said that if the ADU is in the existing building they don’t need to get a building permit. Hatch said we should add it to 301.1 to cover it and add a point of emphasis, that the septic needs to meet state approved requirements, all agreed. On 301.1.11 Williams asked if we need to require a parking space, Kluk said the LUO requires 2 spaces for a dwelling unit. He doesn’t want to restrict the number of driveways you can have but the LUO already does restrict the number of cuts on a lot. The rest of the document we had no problem with. Kluk will make the changes and send out a copy to members.
4.5 Sign Ordinance Update:
Schwartz sent the proposed ordinance to everyone after the last meeting. She heard back from Mike McCrory at UVLSRPC and he had some suggested changes. Kluk took us through his suggestions and we agreed to incorporate them into the document. Kluk will make the changes as agreed and will send out a copy to members. Kluk suggested we take both corrected ordinances and send them to the BoS for comments or suggestions, all agreed. Kluk will send it to them after making the changes.
4.6 Building Permit issue: We will take this up next month.
4.7 Master Plan: We will take this up next month.
5.0 Driveway Permits:
5.1 Alan Chidester, Millen Pond Road, TM 11-39, asking for a permanent driveway for an “other” purpose. Ed Thayer checked the site and recommended a culvert; Crandall checked and noticed there is an existing driveway about five feet away from the newly proposed driveway. Crandall decided he should speak with Chidester’s to understand what the new driveway is for and ask whether they were going to close off the existing driveway. He heard that they are putting in an orchard and the land is already cleared for it. He would like to make closing the other drive a condition of approval, if possible. He will speak to them about it. Williams suggested we add a place on the application to specify what the driveway will be used for if someone picks “other” for the purpose of the driveway.
6.0 Mergers: None
7.0 Communications:
7.1 Intent-to-cut for Kimball Ball, TM 15-164, Faxon Hill Road
7.2 Intent-to-cut for David Ball, TM 15-41, Faxon Hill Road
7.3 Intent-to-cut for Niven, TM 17-15, Smith Pond Road
7.4 DES, Septic approval, 2115 Valley Road, Strickland
7.5 DES, Septic approval, Washington Heights Road, Dube
7.6 Copy of Expedited Wetland Permit, Eversource, Island Pond cable replacement
7.7 Copy of a letter from the Liquor Commission regarding their receipt of the joint BoS and PB letter asking for 90 days before their approval for Ryan Curran.
8.0 Meeting date for next Planning Board meeting, August 2, 2016, at 6:30PM
Kluk noted that we have a working meeting scheduled for Thursday, June 7th at 7PM with the Fire/Rescue group and a working meeting scheduled on Monday, July 11th at 9AM at Camp Morgan Lodge.
9.0 Adjournment: Time: 8:35 pm
Motioned by Dulac, seconded by Crandall, all voted in favor.
Respectfully Submitted,
Nan Schwartz